HP, Chaos, and QM

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7 Responses

  1. Bob Miller says:

    As I understand Rav Chaim Friedlander ZT”L in Sifsei Chaim (in the translation published by Feldheim), those Jews who do not merit 100% HP are still
    1. under complete individual scrutiny
    2. individually treated, at least in part, according to their utility in supporting those at a higher HP level (as opposed to being treated according to their own actions). This is a chessed, since judgment of such people according to their own actions would lead to a less favorable treatment.

    In like fashion, the rest of creation would be treated according to utility, as in 2. above. For non-Jewish nations, the treatment would be routed through their princes (angels assigned to them).

  2. micha says:

    I’m not so sure why someone would assume Jews and non-Jews differ in terms of HP. Even the Kuzari, who says Jews and non-Jews are different in kind (he ranks 5 levels of creation: domeim, tzomeiach, chai, medaber, yisrael) lumps Jews and chassidei umos ha’olam together WRT hashgachah (5:20 and elsewhere). National hashgachah, yes — as you note, ours is more “direct”, and thus less confined by nature / fate / mazal.

    Also, your #1 is a necessary consequence of belief in sechar va’onesh.

    I also wonder why RCF would assume the position of those rishonim who say HP is earned over those who say it’s universal to people (but not to objects, plants or animals).

    • Bob Miller says:

      I suggest that you read through RCF’s analysis again to see if I captured his message accurately.

      On your other point, concerning the Rishonim, I have the sense that the definition of HP according to RCF may not be theirs or the most common defintion.

      • micha says:

        I actually did understand RCF differently. He says (pp 82-83) the Ramban holds that HP is earned. He doesn’t mention what I said, that the Rambam holds that HP is universal across all people (Moreh 3:17) — but not all homo sapiens are equally people (ch. 18). Pretty much the same thing as the Ramban, but a different explanation of how it’s proportional to attachment to G-d, and what constitutes attachment to G-d. (As per my earlier bit about how the Rambam intellectualizes man’s goal more than anyone else does).

        In contrast, RDF shows the Ramaq (pp 83-87) as an example of someone (not a rishon, but pre-Gra / Besht) who champions HP for all people. This is the opinion the Rambam attributes to Chazal (ch. 17), which is why he needs to take his route to proportional HP — so that it doesn’t outright contradict them.

        But I didn’t see RCF picking sides.

        What you call a higher level HP I think is more accurately termed hashgachah kelalis. IOW, a person may have a tailored outcome even when he doesn’t deserve that kind of attention because that outcome plays a critical role in Hashem’s big plan.

        RCF talks also about direct vs indirect causality, which I didn’t follow well enough to have a real opinion about. The same is true with my lack of clarity on his source — the Kuzari 5:20.

        • Bob Miller says:

          What I meant by a “higher level of HP” was a higher status in the beinoni-tzaddik continuum that would qualify one for treatment more weighted to his personal deeds. Someone with a lower status could gain better treatment by supporting such a person, knowingly or unknowingly.

  3. Anonymous says:

    Interesting…Please see your Mashiach ben Yoseph article.

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